The Scam Behind Joovv Red Light Therapy (and all the other brands) - 3 of 5

The Scam Behind Joovv Red Light Therapy (and all the other brands) - 3 of 5

April 25, 2020

Half-readable machine-made transcription.

[0:31:59] - Original video starting at this time

Five ten years. It's been quite a bit of research coming out showing that there are some very large. There's been a lot of research coming out in the past five ten years showing that you can get some some pretty incredible a fax from near IR light just like UV lights for the go to the synthesis of vitamin D and their other portions of the the light spectrum that have other biological effects. So just to touch briefly on that. It's speculated that it interacts with the mitochondria with cytochrome C oxidase and simply make mitochondria work better which are of course fundamental to every cell and that's why I'm practice you see a ton of wide-ranging effects there some other mechanisms proposed. I'm led to things like a cellular viscosity of water, which is I think that's kind of materials person and some other mechanisms are boosting nitric oxide and so-so.


The fact that people are showing with near are some more interesting ones are for the brain from your infrared wavelengths will penetrate the skull rather effectively and they're being used even stay to treat for any sort of traumatic brain injury and people are seeing huge outcomes in terms of reducing the damage some other areas are with neurodegenerative diseases potentially even reversing some of those processes. So really good for the brain other areas are for muscles to some other areas of Interest are that it can help with the connective tissue joints muscles enhancing effects of exercise for getting more hypertrophy. There's been a few Styles than that. It's been used to treat pain foot pain. Any sort of aches joint pain really cool is you can see sort of an open wound and apply

Find near infrared light to it and the wound will actually heal in a much faster time than a Naturally Wood. So it's some sort of cellular healing process that gets accelerated. So it sort of makes sense. Why would help with something like strength training where you're getting this part of it? It's a hormonal response, but part of it. It's it's damaged and then the response to that the that the body adapts and your infrared light is something that you would naturally get from the sunlight if you were outside all day and then we don't get very much of that because we're indoors all day. So it's a lot of near-infrared light panels. The problem is they're not very bright and that's actually kind of fun. No one's actually built a good near-infrared panel from the ground up the way you get here infrared light panels. Today is marijuana grow lights. That's where they all come from. So Greenhouse panel lights and you just switch out the LEDs than them and there's your near-infrared light. So this

Is essential like a drop-shipping business? There's no Engineering in it now because there's a pretty new area of research. It's so that a few Brands and companies have sort of jumped on board with it and just start importing these and and Bill just slap their own label on it. So so that's a pretty easy process. If you look at these panels, it's kind of funny, but they don't actually know how to look at things like how much power there using how much lights are emitting the people running these businesses are not Engineers that they're just marketers the biggest brand friend since is a Jew vaitai message them. They have a 300w they call it that 300 watt panel. I message them and then you can find out the real number of witches. They was 68.5. So just the crazy thing about near-infrared light panels is every single manufacturer is lying to your own.

All of them and they're not actually doing it intentionally. They're just they just don't know cuz they're not technical people and demanded part of it is the the manufacturer that they're getting it from is not giving them the correct specs and they don't know how to tease those out because you get these pre-packaged devices that come from grow lights and don't actually building or designing their own lights it if you look at Jew friend since we'll just use them as the case study that they're all the same what various is the pricing and the logo and you know, which one did you ask on Alibaba to get with you friend since you have their what they call their solar panel. It's about 3 ft by 9 in and they call it or at least they used to call it a 300 watt panel. I just checked. I think I might have actually taken that down from their website because they've probably realize that they have just so much Miss waste.

I have to check it a little mix people are starting to call him out on it. So they say it's the 300 watt panel when you ask them about this and you can figure this out at finally got a customer service rep over Facebook Messenger to tell me the real answer, which was I asked you how much power does the thing actually consumed from a wall outlet and and they actually didn't give me that what they gave me was the the light radiation which was 68.54 about a quarter of your 300 number but your input light is always going to be higher than your radiation because you don't ever have anywhere near a hundred percent efficiency specifically with near IR LEDs. You typically get some around 50% efficiency. So that 68.5 becomes closer to 1:40. So 1:40 is your real number for what the powers and they call it 300. Why do they do that? It's because that's

How did the Chinese manufacturers refer to the LEDs they call him 300 W rated but there's a range of voltages and currents you run the mat. And that's the theoretical P that you could run it a tad for short time. You play burn it out pretty quickly some practice. The devices are all set to be running at a much lower value. So if you buy an LED just like a light bulb and its rated 9 Watts. That means it's pulling 9 Watts. That's where you're getting. So every near-ir is light as it is like that where the actual number what you do is you divide by a little more than two and that's the real power. So you can't blame them too much for that. I guess cuz everyone sort of has that the same standard number and it really people aren't calculating what that means. So it's it's somewhat arbitrates consistent.

Fairly consistent at least between different panel. So it gives you a good relative measure. The real problem is not the power input to this device. The real problem is the power output the radiation. That's that's what you really care about. So my starting point, I mean like I looked at the panels they were all so overpriced and ineffective that I just built my own thing and mostly ignored them for a while. You need to look at the the neuron Fred radiation coming out of these devices to understand your dosing how much light is is hitting my body? Where is it hitting my body how much my Denning and and then you can do something like, okay. Look at what do the research say say is a good amount of dosing how how much near infrared light. Do I want to get a good response but beyond the studies you can say what does sunlight give me if I'm outside throughout the day or for a couple hours at the beach how much near-infrared light am I going to get and if you had a panel that you find this is

About 10% of the light I can get by taking a walk outside. You might think twice about paying several hundred dollars are several thousand dollars to to get that device. And then the problem is that compared to sunlight. It's it's iffy, you know, you can get some but if you really want something better that the price is just balloon is especially if from some Brands and like I said, they're all the same so it's it's pretty foolish honestly to to get something from other brands this free him just as a side note. I really dislike that the way companies like Joovv Market themselves, they pretend they built the thing themselves that they insinuate that other people somehow have inferior product when it's all the same stuff from China and and they're they're really hostile to they they have a patent which is in the process of they don't have a patent. They have a patent application which is in the Pro.

Process of being rejected but because they're recognized as sort of the brand leader, they're able to send cease-and-desist letters to two really tiny companies that are trying to do this sort of business and scare them into shutting them down by threatening them with huge legal fees. And you know, if you're just starting a small business and you don't know that it's probably a good idea to just ignore that sort of stuff and there they can push a competitor's which clearly tells you where their mindset is that did. It doesn't matter that they're jerks. What matters is that they're thinking that they know they can't make anything good. They can't build anything because they're not Engineers. So if they could build something they would look at growing the market that instead they look at a tiny Market of a largely gullible people that's their audience. If you look on their website, they reflected that bullshit like electrostatically coated LEDs. It's

Same sort of, you know, pseudo-scientific language that you would see surrounding homeopathic medicine and this bothers me because if you look at the research on your Fred light, it is very exciting is so it's it's a Pity that you have these these low-tier Brands coming out that really is and make it look bad in on a peeling tattoo to anyone who sees that as their first encounter. It's just assume it's junk just because of of the whole way that they dress them. So that's unfortunate. But the one thing I will say that's that I appreciate that. Maybe they can take some credit for his they got me interested in it. Maybe maybe they played a role in that so that's good. Maybe not so good for him but good for you.

Red light companies really miss Lee do it's on the radiation. And so if you're looking at how much near-infrared light you're getting if you look at a food, you would make that a mess if you're looking at light in motion that in energy and if you're looking at energy, it's how much when you look at how much energy you're delivering / a certain amount of time. That's your power. I saw those are two things. That's how much power you're delivering and how much energy do you deliver? If you have something that's low power. You need to use it for a long time to get the same total energy and the wave at near-infrared light the way people think it works is more or less that it's an accumulative process as long as the energy is high enough to meet a certain threshold. So we look at an example of the the Joovv like for instance what they called the solo light that which they say has 68.5 watts of radiation.

The only thing they say is okay. What's the power of that light you're getting which is what's usually highlighted on the spec shows that the power area. So if you have a really small panel and end with same power than your power prayer goes up have a really large panel got a panel the size of a wall. You're only going to get a small portion of that. So you just look at the power per area and look at where on your body. Is that getting you so what they say is that their light has over a hundred milliwatts by distance and some other companies will also show you a person standing by a panel and saying what the power density is at a certain distance to look worse as you get farther away the lights red lights out and then the the power density brought. So a hundred watts per square centimeter is is roughly what they all say. Varies a little bit, but they're in that ballpark, so

So let's do the math on that. They have a panel that is about 3 ft by 9 in so that's about 20 cm by 100 cm mm square cm and 100 milliwatts. So two thousand twenty thousand two hundred thousand. You have a hundred watts per square cm, so if you have your 3 ft by 9 inch panel that's going to be about 20 cm by 100 cm or mm square cm and you have a 100 ml watts per square centimeter. So Point 1 watts per square centimeter 2000 square centimeters. That's 200 watt.

But you said it was 60.5 Watts, which is a lot less and that's 68.5. That's the real number but based on their usually that's the wrong number. That's about that's about three times. The real number is about 33 per centimeter squared which is quite a bit earlier and that's if the panel is right at your body, which it usually is if you imagine that you had the panel Foot In Front Of You the way most people do in fact the way they show many photos. Then you have like going to the side like going to the other side light above you like below you and what can you say some part of it hits the profile of your body. I think calling it a third would be generous. So from a 33% meter squared now, you're down for 11 watts per centimeter squared. So we're getting pretty low and woke.

Which is how much of that is actually near infrared vs. Red. It's only half near infrared and that's how most panels are one reason for that is your deep red lights at 616 anime triggers more of the effects of skin. I've never really cared much for that. I think there are other better ways to have attractive looking skin, but it's it's funny rhyme for red in the 800 to 900 nanometer range 8:10 to 8:50 is really where people folks and where most of the research is not the stuff that can actually penetrate tissue effectively and and really get to things like connective tissue to the brain deep into the muscles to the bones that sort of thing and that's what I really care about. So if you're looking at just your near-infrared now, you're down to two just over 5 million watts per square centimeter, which I don't think it is is very much and for me it is not

Very very interesting as device and and like I said all of these panels you didn't invent these These are greenhouse panels. They are meant for a tray of vegetables or marijuana sitting underneath them then tired day versus what you've describes which is use it for 10:30 minutes or something which obviously it's it's a bit impractical have something like that to to be using it all day and because of the form factor being a panel it's hard to apply that to the body effectively and and really getting all of the Power of that panel withdrew. The they were what they were trying to send a cease-and-desist about was they were saying that idea of hanging the panel on a door frame. So that's their patent that's getting rejected. It seems which is funny because they have vents in the back. So he do that you block the airflow.

Marcus design 5 or so milliwatts per square centimeter of your near-infrared light from any sort of paneling. So it doesn't really matter how big it is because they all scale roughly to that. So if you get a bigger panel your power per area stays constant, which means you could cover more of your body potentially, but you still have that low power. So how does that compare to sunlight? You can look at studies and then or genital touching that too but I think sunlight is a good reference cuz if you're paying for for something you should have it be at least sunlight or something maybe more than that. If you want to really concentrate affect. I want a really high concentration effect of near-infrared light. The reason I got into it is I'm a rock climber and I'd scare my 8 what's going to a Chipotle in this finger right here poor impulse control. I just tried climbing really hard and it tears.

Not really that painful but it makes it very hard to to pull with it. And then I can't climb for a while. So I want to kill that faster than one of the things actually that the research Point me toward was nitric oxide which incidentally is one of the things that near Fred light up regulates, but I think the mitochondrial aspect plays a large role. So let's take a look at Sun Lakes. If you look at what the spectrum of that looks like and look at your 815 anime band range in which is being a bit narrow me cuz you're just on or just above I still get some effects that didn't deliver. Sure people sometimes tribe has eight hundred two two nine hundred this the range that responds with the the cytochrome C oxidase. That's what has an absorption in the mitochondria. And it's also the band that can go through tissue really? Well just like, you know microwaves can go through food near IR can go through stuff pretty well, too.

has about you look at the graph you have about half your height on the 852 and it's about one micrometer wines a thousand nanometers wide and then it really just drops off and the longer I are bands and so half and 10 of your with we can run the numbers but it looks like roughly 5% and we don't need to be exact here is just ballpark. So 5% of your sunlight in terms of the percentage of the energy is going to be the new infrared light. And so what is the energy dosage you can get from sunlight? So if you look at your son might you're getting about a thousand watts per meter Square. So out of that then you get 50 watts per meter squared that is going to be your near-infrared and so 1 meter squared 100 cm by 100 cm 10,000

Send me a square and we said 50 Watts a so that's $50,000 / 10 5000 watts and divided by 1000 7-5. That's exactly what the knockout them to line up that closely. So the panel is almost exactly the same as being in sunlight except you can be in sunlight a lot longer than you're probably going to want to stand by panel which to me makes it a near useless product and it's not entirely useless if it's winter and you're not going to be getting that sort of intensity. And so if you really want it for winter jacket work, but at that point, it's just good to know that what you're getting is the equivalent of someone without all the other good things in it and that makes it a pretty gimmicky product in my view which is why I know


Bob one I started building my own thing. Well before I thought about doing a business. So what's the conclusion Joovv is a pretty slimy company. They have no Engineers of marketing people. All the panels are the same that I'll just grow lights from greenhouses. They all lie about their specs because they don't know any better. So don't get too mad at the one more thing. How did they get these completely wrong numbers? They use a device to test the radiant intensity that's used for looking at broad spectrum like for sunlight or looking at solar power and look at how much energy are you going to be getting? The problem is the way those work is those devices expect a particular distribution of light and then go look at a particular value that for whatever way the devices constructed makes it easy to measure that value and if you have a pretty

Uniform spectral power distribution then you can essentially guess how much power you have to be pretty accurate. If you're looking at some like you're looking at something completely different than your numbers are going to be completely off. So Joovv either doesn't know this or doesn't care. Neither. Do any of the other companies say just report what the cheap $100, I don't know what they're called the trade and if you look at actual lab grade equipment, which I have for looked at for lenses at the University you get stuff that can cause several thousand dollars yet accurate spectral testing data and it's a Sprite inconvenient to do and no one's really asking so that's what happens if I just mentioned how every near Fred Light Panel socks and how there's a lot of promising research and didn't give you a better solution. So I am building something better and it's pretty similar to the thing I built it for myself a year ago, but much less.

Fancy version of that and that's going to be convenient for people that use and what I'm doing is essentially taking a really large panel that would be pretty overpriced and cramming all that power into a brick since Leah block and that means you can use it in a very concentrated way which is Exacta device. I wanted cuz I can put my hand on it and get my finger doing what I want. I want my finger healing. I want to be able to start up my forms for climbing strength and you'll be a bit heavy and inconvenient to move around in our care. I'm doing a very specific case witches. And so if other people want to use it and other ways that's their problem will all eventually figure out other things but you can't solve things for everyone that the Air Force actually learned that the hard way they were designing a seat to fit in a fighter jet and they they took a bunch of measurements. So you have to have very precise fittings. They looked at things like Head Shoulders different things.

And then they took the average of these measurements for every single person and design to see around this process and I thought you know, maybe it'll fit, you know, 2/3 of people if you go with average exactly zero people no one was average so you can't build for the average, you know, if people figure out other ways to use that's great the way I'm planning on using it and I am not giving any advice or recommendation cuz this is not a medical device. It's not meant actually heal anything. It's a wellness device. It's take healthy people and bring them more sunlight. So it's actually not operating on your body. It's operating on the building you're in and operating as a sort of a chromatic portal. It is transferring light that you would naturally get from the sunlight. It gets processed a bit, you know plant oil power plant and then goes at your house through the LED and then gets real.

So that's all it is and it is it's going to have a power density that is more than 20 times. It's going to be a lot higher than any sort of panele can get and it's also going to be a lot higher than sunlight because I don't want to be using it all day. In fact, this thing is going to be powerful enough. You better not leave your hand lying on there for a long time and it will probably cause a burn intensely severe thermal damage my ideas. You just put your hand. It's it's not going to be an instant thing. So 10 seconds, you'll just a Top Fuel warm. So you'll naturally move your hand away. But that's the thing. I'm building and after that maybe I'll build other things that will also be a lot better than sitting by a panel that has most of the like going out to the side, but that's the 1st near infrared light device. There's a few other things I've built for myself just to try out as I mentioned. There's a lot of cognitive benefits and

So I just put one on my head and put way more power than you can get. So the thing I built to put on my head. It's a helmet that you know, how they said. It's rated 200 Watts a real play the max Powers 100 Watts. I have driven it a little past that and that is far more powerful than the Caps or face mask that you can get today the biggest market for that is that for baldness? That's how they sell them because there is actually research related to that and it's also good for skin, but I want stuff that's going to my brain which means needs a lot more power and there's also a device called the vielight which is also pretty low power. But Target in a few areas are you can't be that potatoes to my idea is just flat everything with near infrared light and that's really what it does. It's just increasing blood flow just activating things.

Sitting in a cave all day slowly die and Decay and that's sort of what a modern building is like so that's what I'm trying to do. And that's not something I'm going to be releasing anytime soon. Let's talk about indoor lighting and buildings and things like CRI color rendering index which some people mistakenly think is important and it's important that you have high-quality light a CRI doesn't tell you that you do. So, let's step back from CRI and look at why most indoor lights suck as you're probably aware a lot of lights in a lot of the trends toward lights now are LED lights cuz those are the most energy efficient. There are a few problems with LEDs first. It's that Dwayne LED works as a white light is you don't actually have an LED that's a white LED. I have something like a blue LED that emits just blue light in a narrow band and then you have a layer of fat.

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